Start Here / Never Stop Podcast

The UNC School of Media and Journalism’s tagline Start Here / Never Stop captures the idea that what students learn and experience at the school prepares them for successful careers and transitions in a dynamic media environment.


This podcast highlights the meaning behind the tagline through conversations between Dean Susan King and influential alumni, faculty, staff, students and speakers.


Carolyn Van Houten '14 | Justin Lyons '06 | Rochelle Riley '81 | Brooke Baldwin '01 | Jeff Mittelstadt '12 (M.A.) | Nikole Hannah-Jones '03 (M.A.) | Brad Hamm '96 (Ph.D.) | Aaron Dodson '15 | Roxane Coche '13 (Ph.D.) | Leigh Goodwyn '88 | Tarini Parti '12 | Lisa Stockman '91, '13 (M.A.) | Kathryn Walker '16 | Jess Clark '15 (M.A.) | Claudia Howard '03 | Emily Steel '06 | Alexandra Rizk Keane '14 | Pailin Wedel '04 | Rachel McMahan '17 (M.A.) | Parth Shah '15 | Jason Cooper '01 | Christina Vidal '12 | Natasha Duarte '11, '16 (M.A.) | Brian Strong '00 | Kat Downs Mulder '06 | Lisa Arney '03 (M.A.) | Reema Khrais '12 | Lindsay Shookus '02 | Robyn Tomlin '96 | Andrew Schorr '71 | Kit Hoover '92 | Chris Brown ’91 and C.L. Brown '94 | Haleh Moddasser '85 | Patrick Winn '03 | Delia D'Ambra '14 | David Tinson '96 | Covering Marginalized Communities: Stories From the Field | Grace Raynor '15 | Ashlan Cousteau '02 | Leah Ashburn '92 | Stefan Prelog '96 (M.A.) | Caitlin Owens '14  | Allen Bosworth '81 | Anu Anand '95 | Ilana Finley '00 | Bill Morton '62 | Corrie MacLaggan '02 | Jacqueline Charles '94 | Joyce Fitzpatrick '76 | Walter Hussman, Jr. '68  | Jordan Fieulleteau '16, '18 (M.A.)

Oct. 10, 2019

Jordan Fieulleteau '16, '18 (M.A.) is a research fellow at the American Voices Project, a project undertaken by the Stanford Center on Poverty and Inequality, Princeton University’s Center for Research on Child Wellbeing and the American Institutes for Research. Click here to read more

This is the Start Here / Never Stop Podcast with Dean Susan King at the Hussman School of Journalism and Media.

00:00:16 Dean Susan King: Hello, this is Susan King — for the first time on this podcast saying — the Dean of the Hussman School of Journalism and Media. And with us one of our top grads —a double Tar Heel — Jordan Fieulleteau class of ’16, and class of ’18 with a master's degree. Welcome, Jordan to the first Hussman podcast.

00:00:34 Jordan Fieulleteau: Thank you so much, I'm happy to be on here to speak with you today.

00:00:38 King: And we're very excited because you've had such an interesting career as one of the athletes a varsity athlete here at UNC. So you've gone from football to journalism — from a master's degree here in North Carolina to Stanford and Princeton fellowship. From starting here to maybe going to law or Congress so you're never stopping. This has been quite a journey for you.

00:01:03 Fieulleteau: Yeah, it's been incredible — been a very humbling experience. And it's shown me that working hard and really believing in yourself and the people around you can really get you far and where you want to go. And my experience at UNC was incredible and unique just because I was able to play football and also get a top-notch education. And I knew from as soon as I got the UNC I wanted to be in the journalism school. And there was something that was very important to me to like make sure I got into the journalism school when I was applying — because I knew in high school that's what I wanted to be as well. I actually toured the journalism school when I was getting recruited, and it kind of like sold me on UNC.

00:01:54 King: Oh, I'm glad to hear that. I'm glad it wasn't just the Kenan football stadium. But in fact, you were the sports editor weren't you at Wakefield High?

00:02:02 Fieulleteau: Yeah, so my junior and senior year I was —  and it was kind of a way for me to escape from football. And I guess that's something I've always carried and still carry today.

00:02:11: *Football Cheering*

00:02:14 King: But you came here as an athlete and a serious athlete. You were recruited pretty early— so talk a little bit about the role of football in your life. And in selecting you pretty early on, it's not only an athlete — but as a leader.

00:02:29 Fieulleteau:  So football to this day honestly it's still a very big part of my life. And I mean it was the mechanism for me to get to where I am today — my ability to play football obviously — afforded me the opportunity to go to UNC and not have to pay any money. And football was always instrumental in my life just because I started playing that right after my dad passed away. So it was kind of like a mechanism for me to like get away from kind of like the thoughts that came with that tragedy. And then I just dedicated my career to him. And I didn't imagine like the success I had in like high school and stuff. Yeah, I'm very thankful to have been able to play football at a high level — and to where it afforded me other opportunities.

00:03:14 King: And it's a tough sport though — you know, it's I mean it's a team sport— that's an amazing power of it. But you know — it's a brutal sport. So what was it about it that you found so powerful and appealing?

00:03:29 Fieulleteau: Really is like the friendships — like yeah, football is like a really good sport to play. And obviously, it comes with a lot of like publicity and like it just playing against such good competition. And obviously, it's just so it's like the most popular sport in America, which makes it that much more fun to play, because everybody's always watching. But really for me, it was like the  friendships. I made some of like the best friends I ever have for the rest of my life, most likely playing football at UNC. And even in high school, I still have a lot of my friends from high school football. And I feel like it teaches you lessons that unless you play with a team sport with 11 different players — like each person whose dad was like unique and everybody has to do something collectively all get to the same success. I think it's like something that is very unique. And even like today, I noticed like my experience in football helps me like professionally as well.

00:04:23 King: But you also had a turning point in football when you decided that you were going to spend more time here in the journalism school — and kind of gave up football as the preoccupation of your UNC years. Tell me about that turning point.

00:04:37 Fieulleteau: Yeah. So like towards like the middle-to- end of my redshirt junior season — which was my fourth season at UNC I decided to step away from the football team. And just because of a multitude of different reasons I wasn't happy with — like playing time. Also just didn’t see like eye-to-eye with where the program or where the coaching direction of the program going. And also, I had gotten accepted and had already started my master's at UNC. And as soon as I left the football team, I saw myself —saw a lot of doors opening that wouldn't have been opened unless I had stepped away from football — at least for that one year that I did. And so I was able to go to Europe as a delegate my first spring and in my master's program. And I would never have been able to do that if I was like doing spring football. And now it's like an incredible opportunity. And that's when I started getting really interested in politics. Because I got to meet like some of the representatives in the European Parliament when I was there for the EU, and stuff like that. So that really got me more interested in politics. And it's kind of like today where I'm very, very, always on the pulse of what's going on the news and the politics.

00:06:05 King: Yeah, you saw the public square, which we sort of emphasize here so much for those who are in strategic communications, like you are doing in graduate school. And you were intrigued by that public square what you could do there.

00:06:17 Fieulleteau: Yeah, for sure. So I always I mean, even in undergrad when I did PR, and when I was applying to the graduate program, I mean, PR is everywhere. In every arena, whether it's sports, whether it's politics, whether it's work, whether it's, I mean, it's just it touches every aspect of American life, political advertising, and I knew that that was going to be like a long term thing that I wanted to do, just because I felt like it was more secure than football, but also because I just felt a very, I was immediately like drawn to that field. And even to this day, I'm doing a lot of PR stuff, even though the role that I'm in as a research fellow. So I see that like, every day. And I'm very happy to be like, I always say like a lot of people don't use their degree when they graduate. But I'm very happy to say that I'm definitely using mine.

00:07:14 King: And I know there were two really important women in your life while you were here. Your mother, Kendra Clark, and your mentor Trevy McDonald.

00:07:23 Fieulleteau: Yeah, so actually talking to me this morning. And so, first of all, my mother definitely wouldn't be nowhere near where I am today without her, all the sacrifices she made moving up in New York when we were 11, as my dad passed away, and being a single parent in America is just very hard to actually with the dynamic of raising two young black men. So I thank her for everything. And then Trevy. It's kind of like the coincidence, I just took her class one day, or one semester, and invited her to football practice. And then so like a policy, we had to like, invite Professor to practice, spring. And I invited her and then we had dinner after and I thought I was thinking about applying. And she convinced me to apply to grad school, when I didn't really think I could get in and ended up getting in. And it was honestly like a relationship that I still have to this day. And something that really grew throughout graduate school and in graduate school, a lot more worthwhile. Because having that support when like things weren't going well, or if I hadn't question there was always like her office, office door’s always open. And still is to this day, even though I'm not there anymore.

00:08:32 King: That's to me the difference between our program and many. You get professors who are with you for a lifetime — but really bring something extra to the to the experience.

00:08:41 Fieulleteau: Yeah, for sure , you know, I keep in touch with a lot of different professors in the J-school and high EVK. So yeah, that was one of the best parts about the journalism school is like the relationships.

00:08:58 King: Now when you left us, you got it really what sounds like a very cool job in the digital world at Facebook. Wow. And then you went on for this fellowship that's really focused on income inequality. That's, that's pretty different. Tell us about that.

00:09:13 Fieulleteau: So the fellowship has been very eye opening, to say the least. So I guess the premise in a little bit about the study is across this year, we're going to be interviewing 5,000 households, which represent 300 million households in America. And all these households are randomly selected. So the city I'm in was randomly selected in the neighborhoods and cities were randomly selected. And that helps us get a representative snapshot of what life is like in America for people in 2019. And I joined the project because I felt like a big aspect of it was listening to the stories of the American people, I feel like with politicians, politicians aren't listening to the constituents, and the level of detail that me and 50 other research fellows are listening to respondents this year. And we're hearing the life stories of people were hand their suggestions to what they think can work better in our lives. And what works, what's working well in their lives. And I think that the people should always have an input into what policies are drawn, and what policies are crafted that are going to benefit them. And that's a big aspect of the study. And especially people in high poverty areas need more investment and more, more attention, and more resources drawn into those c ommunities. And what what are they think is going to work well for them and what's not working well for them? Well, we don't know, unless we actually gone to those communities and hear those people speak.

00:10:48 King: Some people may see Oh, that's a far, far cry from where you began here yet. I bet your quarterback friend — your roommate here and his Chicago bear star. He still holds you as one of his best friends, he probably wants some of those insights you're getting.

00:11:05 Fieulleteau: Yeah, so I mean, even in the city, he lives in Chicago, multitude issues that are going on there. And those communities and that people in Chicago from this project, and I always keep them updated about and him and all my friends about like, what am I seeing in the field. Like, what are the some of the trends that we're seeing that the public on paying attention to right now. And I know he’s very happy for me and the fellowship. And it's definitely gotten a positive feedback from all my friends about what I'm seeing in the field. And just like the desire to hope, hopefully make change.

00:11:39 King: So what would you tell students today, you know, they come in sometimes not sure where they're going to go, you were a little bit like that you pick PR, you got a graduate degree, what's the advice you share with our students about their future?

00:11:52 Fieulleteau: Take it one day at a time, but always think, with the future in mind. So all the decisions you're making now are going to affect your future, your future life in the future decisions that you're making. So I'd say always think with the future in mind and decisions you make today are going to affect you later down the road. So I'd say just be very calculated with the decisions you make. And it's okay if you don't know what major you want to do the first day or the second day, or even after a year, because the journalism school first off has like 15 different concentrations, and everybody and then we're going to help you so don't be afraid to ask for help. That was actually one of the biggest things for me is I was never really afraid to ask for help. And I noticed that a lot of people are and the resources that are available. If you just ask for help people want to help you. So definitely never be afraid to ask for help.

00:12:42 King: Well, Jordan, we always knock on your door for some help. And we always want you to come back and it's a big year for football. Mack is back and people are excited, but we're excited about where you're headed. We're glad you're never going to stop. So thanks for being our first Hussman podcast. Great to talk to you and we'll see you soon.


September 9, 2019

Walter Hussman, Jr. '68 With a $25 million gift in unrestricted endowed funds, Hussman, his wife Ben and their family make a significant investment in not only students, faculty and staff at the Hussman School, but also in the future of a profession which has the power to shape the world for the better. Click here to read more

00:00:08 Dean Susan King: Hello, I'm Susan King, the Dean of while I'm so honored to say for the first time, the Dean of the UNC Hussman School of Journalism and Media. Sounds pretty good, doesn't it Walter Hussman?

00:00:20 Walter Hussman, Jr.: Sounds good to me.

00:00:22 King: This is such a big moment for the school. And I hope for you, you have made an amazing gift to the school and its future. Why?

00:00:31 Hussman: Well, we really, you know, we love the University of North Carolina, and we love the school of journalism. But we also love journalism with a passion and I certainly do. Our family really does. And it's an important time in American journalism. And it's an important time to renew the principles and the standards and the values that have stood the test of time in journalism. And it's so important to me that the school has adopted that type of statement of core values, to not only teach its students, but to stand up and show the rest of America to lead in this regard.

00:01:09 King: We're so honored to be able to be part of this at this moment — and also you’re a graduate — so so is your daughter, masters of our school and undergraduate. So this is a real tradition in the school. And to say, though, that you'll put your name on the school really is, it's not something one does without deep thinking,

00:01:29 Hussman: Exactly. Well, I wouldn't be putting my name on the school if you weren't the dean.

00:01:34 King: *laughs*

00:01:35 Hussman: And if the school wasn't willing to adopt a statement of core values that they are adopting, that I think is so important to the future of journalism, and America — which I think is so important to the future of our country and our democracy.

00:01:49 King: And those are the core values you learned at our school. So let’s talk about that. I remember our...

00:01:53 Hussman: Yes.

00:01:55 King: ... earliest conversations where you started to craft those core values that are in your newspaper every day.

00:01:59 Hussman: You know, I was thinking about that. And I learned those things in the School of Journalism from 1964 to 1968 —not exactly the middle, but a little past the middle of the 20th century. And it was really the 19th century in America, journalism was a very partisan endeavor. And it really changed around the turn of the century. And interestingly enough, it changed for some business reasons, because a lot of the publishers then — we have to remember, there was no radio or television or any other medium besides newspapers, then —  they realized that if they were not partisan, and they were more impartial, they would get more readers and newspapers got a lot of their money from subscriptions, then. So for most of the 20th century, there was a great tradition of trying to be as objective and as fair as possible. And those are the things I learned in Howell Hall and the journalism school and early to late 60s. And those are the things that I think make journalism so valuable to America.

00:02:50 King: Well, I'm excited that we're going to have those core values etched in stone in our lobby in the school now at Carroll Hall. And to me, there's so many pieces of those values we could emphasize — but for me, you're really saying that the public matters that we serve the public, as journalists, as communicators.

00:03:22 Hussman: Absolutely, we should serve the public. And we should have more confidence in the public, that they are smart enough, intelligent enough to sift through all the facts, and determine what they believe to be the truth. So yes, I think we do serve the public — journalism certainly serves the public. And that's, that's our mission.

00:03:44 King: And you believe that the public can make their own decisions if journalism gives them the facts and the information they need to make decisions.

00:03:51 Hussman: Right. I think as long as we cover both sides, we let both sides speak for themselves. We don't need to take sides; we shouldn't take sides in reporting. Of course, that's the important part of journalism is reporting news, there is a part of it that's providing opinions. And that's fine to take opinions and try to decide which side you favor. But in reporting the news — know, your job is to report the facts and let the readers decide for themselves.

00:04:20 King: Let's talk about this moment, the news industry has lost a lot of America's trust. That seemed to be important for you right now that you emphasize the importance of journalism, because you're worried about this moment in the field.

00:04:33 Hussman: Yes, have really thought about a lot about that it really hurts to see that the news media has lost so much trust among the public. You know, shortly after I got out of journalism school in ’68, and the early 70s to mid 70s. Journalism was probably more highly regarded that at any time that I can remember  — because of Watergate, and because of the courage of newspapers — like the Washington Post and the New York Times, and others, who not only covered the news, but tried to uncover what was going on. And students flocked to journalism schools, mainly because of that. So there was great credibility there. I've thought a lot about how we lost so much of the public trust. Some of it is because we're constantly being attacked — either by politicians, or even some in them, the media themselves — there's constant attacks on “the mainstream media” well, they're obviously some of the mainstream media have made mistakes, etc. But we published newspapers were over 100 years, I guess. We're definitely mainstream media, and we're trying our very best to be objective and fair as we possibly can. So I'm not sure there's a lot we can do about others criticizing us. I do think it's worth us in the news business, trying to look at — re-examine — and look at ourselves and try to say, “are we part of the reason maybe we've lost some of this trust?” And if so, why? And, and try to say, if we just go back to the principles, the values and the standards that have stood the test of time in journalism, we can re-earn the trust of the public. That's why I think that's so important today.

00:06:27 King: And there's also so much change technologically. We have now all the digital opportunities. That's a challenge as well as the economic disruption — so the journalism schools glad to be on the cutting edge of this kind of change.

00:06:40 Hussman: Yes. Well, tech technology generally, I think is a good thing. It generally lowers costs and provides people more options, etc. But you know, it's interesting, because today as newspapers — well, beginning about 20 years ago — many newspapers developed their own websites. And so now there was a new format for newspapers presenting news, as well as television and other news organizations — and that became the website. But lots of other people could create their own websites and say they were news. And but did they really have the same standards, principles and values that got taught in journalism schools? Some did, but obviously, some didn't. And what a lot of people would see those websites where they didn't have those values, and they look pretty much exactly like, the websites of newspapers or television stations that did have those values. They start to get a little the public gets a little bit confused. And I think they start sometimes thanking the people who do have good professional journalistic standards are kind of mixed in with the people who don't. And I think that's eroded some of our credibility. If it was a newspaper, you know, or it was a CBS Evening News or something that had a reputation. It was a unique format that other people couldn't easily replicate. It was easier to trust that I think, but once we started having the exact same format, as people that didn't have those values, I think it that's part of the erosion in the Trump public trust.

00:08:20 King: You're going to be making a big statement to our students who are optimistic and young and choosing journalism as their field. What do you want them to know that you're saying to them? What do you want them to think about?

00:08:31 Hussman: Listen, I don't know which mediums are going to endure. I don't know how well newspapers will endure. I don't know how well TV stations are going to endure in the future, but one thing is going to endure — and that's journalism — because people want the facts. They want to make up their own mind. They want to be given the facts by people who adhere to standards and core values and principles of good journalism — like being impartial, being objective, being as fair as possible, being even-handed. And those are the kind of people they're going to trust. And there's always going to be a demand for people who do that. So I think the future's bright for journalism and whatever form it's going to take in the future.

00:09:19 King: I love that. That is optimism. That is hope. And that's what this moment marks. So Walter at this time of change — when you're being an optimist, you see all the questions being raised about our industry. But you're willing to invest in it in a way that other people have not what is making you put your money where your values are?

00:09:39 Hussman: Well, you know, I was thinking about this recently. I just read a book by David Brooks; It's called second mountain. And he talks in there about four different commitments people have. The first commitment he talked about is a commitment to a calling, or a vocation. And he made an interesting point, he's said, you know, your calling may or may not be your career, it may be something else. And I really thought about that. And I thought, you know, most of my career has been newspaper publishing. But that's not really been my calling, my calling has been journalism. And so I think, you know, the thing that is so important — not only now, but in the future. Is not how the news is delivered, and what format or what way, but the fact that it's done in a fair, objective, even-handed way. And that to me, is the importance of journalism. And I think we've got to invest in that, to try to emphasize that to encourage young people to do that. Because it'll pay big dividends for our whole country if we do it.

00:10:50 King: And what do you mean by that? What kind of big dividends?

00:10:52 Hussman: Well, what I mean by that is, if young people decide — hey, look, let's just try to advance our own personal opinion or personal biases or personal thinking. That's not what we need. We need people to go out and report news report facts, let readers decide for themselves. And sure, it's fine to have people who are opinionated, who let people know what their opinions are. But if we don't have the people who are trying to report news in a fair, objective, unbiased way— we're going to be in big trouble in this country.

00:11:33 King: What do you want the public — I may not be as close to the whole profession of journalism to think about this gift you are making to UNC?

00:11:41 Hussman: I think they need to know that there is a journalism school — one of the leading journalism schools in America — that's taken a position to reinforce the core values that have been the strength of news organizations in America: being impartial, being fair, presenting both sides. And, you know, those are old time-tested principles. And I've often heard people say, “Oh, well, you can't be objective everybody's got some biases. So why should you even try?” And I turn them around and say, if I ask one of our readers, what do they want me to say? “Hey, I'm not even going to try to be objective, because I can't be objective,” or do they want me to say, “I'm going to be as objective as I can and try as hard as I can. And, you know, I know I can't be perfect, but I'm going to strive for it.” I think our readers feel a lot more comfortable with the latter argument than they do the former.

00:12:40 King: And I know you believe in a kind of field reporting that says, here's where the facts are. I may think “x” happened, but I've learned “y” happened. And I report why.

00:12:49 Hussman: Absolutely. You know, we've had reporters that work for us. I can remember a time we had an investigative reporter. And he came in and told me the story he was working on. And it was a significant story. And it had to do with a company that was incinerating hazardous materials. And he thought he had a source telling them that these people are overriding the safety standards — intentionally. And he thought he had a story. And he came back later. And he said, You know, I really felt we had it. I've not been able to corroborate it with anyone. And I've now found another source says — that I really trust it says that's just not the case. And he said, I hate it. I've spent a lot of time on this. I kind of got a lot invested in this. But I —it just wouldn't be fair to run that story. So that, you know, that, to me is good journalism. Not only what you publish, but what you don't publish if you think something is not correct.

00:13:45 King: And that's also called courage.

00:13:47 Hussman: Absolutely. You know, and I think it's important for newspapers to show courage. You know, eight all fox said, you know, many years ago to publish the new without fear or favor. It's really interesting when you think of those two words — fear and favor. You know, you shouldn't be fearful of what people in social media are going to say. Heck, they're going to say just about anything.  You shouldn't be fearful of what politicians are going to say — you shouldn't be fearful of what wealthy influential people in the community are going to say. You know, it's also and I found this is often more the case than fear— its favor. People always want you to do them a favor if you're in the news business. And you know, that's not our role to do people favors. Our role is to report the news as fairly as we can. And when we publish opinions to be sure we were publishing as many different sides as we possibly can.

00:14:48 King: I'm glad you're an optimist. I'm glad to believe in tomorrow. And I'm glad you believe in UNC.

00:14:55 Hussman: Absolutely. You know, our readers tell us that, that they love our newspaper —I'm talking about the one where I live in Little Rock, [The] Arkansas Democrat-Gazette. And they really appreciate the reporting we do — they want us to do more of it. They want us to hire more investigative reporters —we do too. We just need a little improvement in the economics to be able to do it. But you know, we get more feedback when we have the type of reporting that uncovers things. But still — even when we uncover things, we give both sides, the ability to state their position. You know, we don't need to tell our readers, okay, this ads right and this ads wrong, quote both sides and let the readers read their quotes. And a lot of times that read it. But you know, that's another thing we need to realize — a lot of our readers are smarter than I am. They're smarter than some of our editors, they're smarter than some of our reporters. I mean, some of these people are really smart, putting on are they smarter, they may have a lot of knowledge in some fields, we don't have nearly as much knowledge in. So I trust our readers to try to sort through it all and make the right decisions.

00:16:12 King: And I have to of course mention Eliza who is part of understanding that changing audience and the changing demographics of your readership. And she's our grad — and she's part of the future of the school and your company.

00:16:26 Hussman: She is, you know, when Eliza got her master's in journalism there at the University of North Carolina and was trying to decide on our career and one of our options was to come back and work for our company. And I told her, you know, you need to think hard and long about this because the fortunes of newspapers are not doing so well. And she said “look, I really believe in the mission of journalism. And I really think it's important to have a family owned business that's not looking quarter to quarter and is looking at the long run on we do.” And so — she has faith in the future of journalism. And that's very encouraging to me. 

00:17:08 King: And we've got the long run. We’ll be talking in 10, 20, and 50 years about what these new generation of Hussman School of Journalism [and] Media students think about tomorrow. Thank you Walter for this amazing historic gift.

00:17:23 Hussman: Sure. Thank you.


August 21, 2019

Joyce Fitzpatrick ’76 is the owner of Fitzpatrick Communications, Inc. with thirty years of experience helping clients use public relations to their advantage. Click here to read more

This is the Start Here / Never Stop podcast with Dean Susan King of the UNC School of Media and Journalism. 

00:00:18 Dean Susan King: Hello. This is Susan King, the Dean of the School of Media and Journalism, here at UNC-Chapel Hill with our alum, Joyce Fitzpatrick class of ’76, who everyone likes to call the “queen of crisis communication.” Welcome, Joyce.

00:00:32 Joyce Fitzpatrick: Glad to be here, Susan, thank you.

00:00:35 King: We want to start really talking about the public relations field. Because when you were here, it was almost not a field, it was not as important as it is now. It’s the largest area of study for our students. What kind of lured you into this? How did you define this as the world you wanted to enter?

00:00:55 Fitzpatrick: Great question, Susan. When I was a student in a journalism school in the ’70s we only had the news ed sequence and the advertising sequence. And I knew that neither one of those fit me quite perfectly, although I was a news ed major. And so frankly, I didn’t know there was such a thing as public relations. All I knew is that I wanted to tell people’s stories in a different way. So, I feel really good about the fact that I did have that news editorial background, because what that does is help you learn to write every day under all kinds of circumstances, early morning, late night. And I feel that that’s still a fundamental talent or skill that you have to have in public relations. So, I feel good about my background, but certainly now having taught in the school and seeing these amazing young people coming out of the school, I know that our public relations sequence is extremely robust.

00:02:10 King: Give me a sort of sense of the vision that you had then and how you would describe it now because it really wasn’t the field it was in the ’70s that it is now.

00:02:19 Fitzpatrick: Now, I mean, again, I felt that I was discovering a whole new field. Yeah, I really didn’t know that there was a thing called public relations. I went straight to Washington, D.C., after graduating — actually, I first worked for a book publishing company, briefly before I went to Washington and — I thought I wanted to be in the publishing business. Got to Washington, got a job with the Association of Governing Boards of Universities and Colleges. Now, at that time, as you know, Susan, Washington was a government town, and not much of a private sector. So, lots and lots and lots of associations. So, I got this job as an editor and public relations person for the Association of Governing Boards, which was an organization that trained and helped college and university trustees understand their governance responsibilities. Heaven knows, I didn't know how handy that would come in...

00:03:25 King: *laughs* I was just thinking the same thing.

00:03:27 Fitzpatrick: ...later in my career, when I seemed to have a practice that specialized in higher education crisis. So I got a good schooling, worked for a wonderful guy who was my mentor — became my mentor — his name was Bob Gale, he was one of the first employees in the Peace Corps, was in the Kennedy administration, he was head of Young Democrats for Humphrey  in ’68 — just an amazing guy — And he introduced me to everybody in in Washington, D.C., who was anybody in the field of journalism, public relations and advertising. So I had a really amazing mentor, which meant so much to me and my career. And I've tried to do the same thing for young people coming out of our school.

00:04:12 King: And it really is the bridge between the world of journalism, which has changed now, because it’s — everybody’s in journalism, if you count social media — and organizations and individuals who need someone to help them navigate that, right? 

00:04:25 Fitzpatrick: Exactly. I look at myself as a facilitator or interpreter. I always felt that there was some sort of artificial barrier between the media and organizations that need to tell their stories or companies that need to tell their story. And so, I always saw myself as almost a doubles partner helping get the ball over the net for the journalists, and vice versa, help the corporations and institutions that I represented, tell their story effectively.

00:05:01 King: And then crisis communications really was not a field either in the ’70s?

00:05:07 Fitzpatrick: Hmm... Yeah, go ahead.

00:05:08 King: No, and it’s now a whole specialty. So tell me how that emerged. How did you see it?

00:05:13 Fitzpatrick: Well. After a brief stint with the Association of Governing Boards in Washington, I met a woman named Myra Peabody [Gossens] and she was in the Carter Administration — this is aging me now, Susan, that I’m talking about all of these past presidents — but she was in the Carter administration, and she had come back from a trip around the world. And she was eager to start a new kind of communications firm, and recruited me — at the ripe age of 25 — to start a business in Washington, D.C. Two females starting a business in Washington, D.C. I was 25. And she was 30. It was right before Ronald Reagan was elected. And actually, with his election, as you know, the private sector in in Washington boomed, and we found a niche representing not only nonprofit museums and higher education institutions, but also corporations new to Washington, needing to understand how Washington works. One of our very first clients was Gallaudet University. 

00:06:20 King: Oh, wow! 

00:06:21 Fitzpatrick: Gallaudet University is a school for the deaf and hard of hearing in Washington, D.C. It’s congressionally mandated. And they had been a client of ours for quite some time when they were in the process of a search for a new president. And at that time, the students at Gallaudet had made it very clear that they felt that Gallaudet needed a deaf president — hard of hearing president — not somebody who was not one of them. And so the search was conducted, and we were representing the Board of Trustees, and the university — because they were going for they were under scrutiny by the Reagan administration in terms of budget — and the search turned up a candidate, the leading candidate who was actually ironically from North Carolina, from UNC-G. And she was an amazing woman, but she was not from the deaf community. And so immediately upon the announcement of her choice, as president, the students rioted. Took over the campus. And would not let the administration back into the administrative building — harkening back to the ’60s, Susan — and that all of a sudden was our first crisis client. To add a little bit of color to that. Both my partner and I were in late stages of pregnancy, while we were handling this first crisis. And it was quite a crisis. We had to have the Board of Trustees meet in our offices. They couldn’t get on campus. We tried to help them understand that this was part of a — this was really a civil rights issue. It was not just a, you know, a group of ruffled kids. And long story short, the board finally understood that it was up against something bigger than itself. And the new president resigned and a hearing, I mean, a deaf president was chosen. So we didn’t choose the crisis. The crisis chose us.

00:08:47 King: I covered that story. I remember very well, Joyce. We were — we didn’t know each other at that time. 

00:08:53 Fitzpatrick: We didn’t.

00:08:55 King: Crisis. Not everyone can handle that. There is hardly a crisis in this area in higher education and elsewhere that you haven’t been part of. What is it that helps you navigate the problems and advise the clients? What do you think your strength is?

00:09:12 Fitzpatrick: Well, thank you. Let me say this, when I made the move from Washington, D.C., back to North Carolina, in the early ’90s — for lifestyle reasons — I commuted to Washington for several years. And then thought “That’s crazy,” and opened an office here of our firm: Peabody Fitzpatrick. When I was coming back to North Carolina, it was right after the OJ Simpson trial. And I thought to myself, you know, I’m going to find, I’m going to do a really good job of researching the legal community in North Carolina. And I’m going to try to find four or five evolved attorneys for whom I can provide communications assistance in times of crisis. So I  really set about it as a research project. And I found them and I’m still working with them to this day. So I really felt that I pioneered the whole, the whole relationship between media and the law. After the OJ case, as you know, Susan, people understood that the court of public opinion was as important if not more important than any court of law. And so I started working with several attorneys, both here and in Washington, all over the East Coast, who understood that that was an important part of what they needed to provide to their clients. And so, we would work as a team. I would be hired by both the attorney, so that was covered by the privilege. And then we would work as a team sorting through the client’s needs. Many times, and still to this day, my attorney friends like to say that people are not so worried about going to prison but are really worried about being on the front page of the newspaper. And so we tried to divide up our, our time and our energy so that my attorney friends could focus on practicing law. And I could focus on trying to minimize their risk and the reputational risk in the in the news. So that’s how we started. And I would say that fundamental to what I still do today. I guess the case of my career that I’m sure you would ask me about is the Duke lacrosse case. Seems like ancient history now. But wow, completely took over my life for two years. We were retained — the attorney Wade Smith and I — were retained by one of the boys who was indicted by one of the lacrosse players. And then as the three, ultimately three boys were indicted. I ended up doing the public relations for all of the boys, the players — while each of the players had his own attorney. And that was a that was a moment, when our backs were against the wall. The media had convicted those players of a capital offense, which is great. We did focus groups in Durham, North Carolina. And we knew if this case went to trial, that those players were going to be convicted. We knew also that something was up. That something was not, was not the things did not add up. Of course, at the beginning, we did not, we had no idea that there was criminal activity on behalf of the district attorney in Durham. We finally figured that out. We also had no idea that when we asked for DNA, we asked for DNA tests. And we were told there was there was no DNA present. Hmmm. Interesting. No DNA present. How could they, how could this woman have been raped by three or four men and have no DNA evidence? What we found out later was that by asking the right questions, interesting story there, if I may, if I may, Susan, they... We got a call from a woman in California, who had worked on the Kobe Bryant case. Who told our attorneys exactly what to ask for from the company doing the DNA testing. And what it revealed was that there was DNA, there was plenty of DNA and then present on and in her body, but not the DNA of the lacrosse players. And of course, that was the break in the case. The role I played in that, because we knew we were so against — our backs were so much against the wall — is that we went to 60 Minutes, knowing that 60 Minutes likes the counterintuitive story where the good guys are the bad guys and bad guys are the good guys. And convinced them to cover the lacrosse case. They did four hour-long pieces that won tons and tons of Peabodies. And again, really turned the case around. But it took two years and it took the intervention of our North Carolina Attorney General Roy Cooper, who’s now our governor, to see that this was a case of completely — a complete fantasy. There was no rape, in this case. And we had Time magazine, Newsweek saying ”Sex, lies and lacrosse.” I mean, it was a phenomenal uphill battle for us. But we are still in touch with the players and their parents to this day. And the players have moved on. The parents I don’t think will ever move on. And Duke University — there’s a lot I could say there — Duke University I don’t think really ever dealt with the case as it should have. If you remember, they fired the lacrosse coach, ended the lacrosse season. Faculty was demanding all kinds of changes to policies at Duke around athletic teams. And you know, unfortunately, as we can see from current issues in higher education today, not many lessons learned.

00:15:29 King: But I’ll tell you something, as you’re telling that story with great attention to detail and the digging. Those news ed classes you took — back to that point of journalism — you’re really digging to get to the next part of the story. So the journalist training is really part of what makes a great public relations professional.

00:15:49 Fitzpatrick: Absolutely. And I — you know, I feel very fond of and nostalgic for the old days, Susan, where news reporters were absolutely envied and championed and celebrated. But I feel that today, even more so, I have the responsibility of making sure that as we tell our clients stories, we are being fair, accurate, and trustworthy ourselves.

00:16:25 King: You’ve been such a great friend and important leader here at the MJ-school. What makes you give back — you’re a chair of our board of advisers here, I don’t think there’s anything I’ve ever asked you to do that you haven’t said yes to — what makes you give back to us?

00:16:37 Fitzpatrick: Gosh, you know, my parents were both schoolteachers, and very much valued public education. And when I was accepted to the University of North Carolina and to the journalism school, I felt — at the very beginning — a tremendous responsibility to give back to you still today. If you look at the tuition at Chapel Hill, only one of our three children went to Chapel Hill, but I couldn’t believe it. When I got the tuition bills. I said, I called the bursor and I said “I believe there’s a mistake. I don’t believe you’ve charged me enough.” She said, “Oh, yes. Yes, yes, we have.” ”Well, I’ll take two.”

00:17:27 King: *laughs*

00:17:28 Fitzpatrick: So we — I felt since I graduated, Susan, that I could never give back to the university, what it’s given to me.

00:17:37 King: And we’re glad that you’re in our Hall of Fame. Since 2000. And you’ve helped to move that up, you saw a vision in our Halls of Fame for North Carolina. Just say a word about that. You and Meryl Rose have moved it up. So...

00:17:48 Fitzpatrick: My good buddy Meryl Rose. Our careers have tracked through the years — Washington and all over the place — and she’s one of my best friends. We decided, when you were in your just first couple years as Dean. And we value your leadership so much, Susan. That we really needed. I’ve always felt that the journalism school now that it has embraced public relations and all kinds of media. We needed to demonstrate to the world: what we teach. And what we teach in public relations is absolutely: producing events, and celebrations that model the class and the character, and the excellence that the school provides. And we felt that through the whole Hall of Fame dinner that we had been having annually for many, many years, that we really needed to make that event more visible, more fun. And because we have so many people who celebrate who have come through either our school or have had some connections North Carolina. So Meryl and I wanted to show the school and to show the university and to show the State of North Carolina what we have here, the treasure that we have. And we hope — we’re trying to do that Susan. And I hope you’ll agree.

00:19:18 King: Oh, totally agree. Plus, you’re helping us to raise some money, which I’m very grateful for. I guess this conversation shows why you became a distinguished young alumna at UNC in ’95. And why we can see you’re a Hall of Famer for sure. But you’re also one of the Triangle’s most powerful women by the Business Journal. So, keep it up!  Thank you for giving us your time and for being always not only a great advocate, but a great storyteller. 

00:19:47 Fitzpatrick: Thank you, Susan.


July 16, 2019

Jacqueline Charles ’94 is a Pulitzer Prize finalist and Emmy Award-winning Caribbean Correspondent at The Miami Herald, a McClatchy-owned paper which circulates in greater Miami and is read throughout Latin America and the Caribbean. Click here to read more

This is the Start Here / Never Stop podcast with Dean Susan King of the UNC School of Media and Journalism.

00:00:18 Dean Susan King: This is Susan King, the Dean of the School of Media and Journalism here at Chapel Hill. And with me, one of our great alums, Jacqueline Charles, class of 94, and welcome. 

00:00:30 Jacqueline Charles: Thank you for having me. 

00:00:32 King: I want to start on really a high note for this year, and then trace some of your movement to the top, but I want to stop at the top —or start at the top, I should say — because you had such an incredible year. Here it is the year 2018, Maria [Moors] Cabot prize, Columbia Journalism School, you take it, that was a big win.

00:00:55 Charles: It definitely was a big one, because I actually had applied a couple of times in the past and at one point became discouraged. Can you imagine be being on the front line of the biggest disaster in this hemisphere, which was the 2010, Haiti earthquake, and doing so many different stories about that huge disaster. And so I applied, I didn't get it. Applied a second time — and both times there were people that I knew who were judges — and finally, a friend of mine, actually a colleague, [NeNe?], who also was the winner. She said “you what, you should apply. So I said, Okay, I'll do it reluctantly. And I did it. And I got it. And interesting enough, when I went up there to receive the award, and I spoke to some of the judges. And I learned from someone — well, the reason why you didn't get in the past is because they thought you were too young. *laughs*

00:01:52 King: Well, I would say it a different way, you had covered some of the emergencies in Haiti. But now you really cover the story —the context, the history, culture. You are America's expert on this amazing country.

00:02:06 Charles: What exactly I mean, what I wanted to do after the earthquake, I remember my editor at the time saying, “okay, what next.” And when he said, but then he was talking about what other beat that I wanted to cover, he felt like maybe I had to sort of reached the end of that Haiti story. But I knew that the disaster was just one thing. But there's so many different stories to cover with this country — and that's why I enjoy covering this beat. Some days, I say, I have the best job in America, because I get to do it all: I get to be a feature writer, I get to be a health writer, I get to be a crime writer, I get to be a political writer. The stories are so diverse, and they're just not always about the disaster, or the political crisis at the moment, which I am currently dealing with. And so I think as a journalist, I mean, you're always looking, you know, tell the story that hasn't been told before, or to tell it in a new way. But you're also looking to be challenged, and you're always looking for diversity, variety — does not necessarily mean that you want to switch jobs — sometimes you like the job, you just need a break! *laughs* From the same ol’ same ol’ and oftentimes Haiti allows me to do that. I mean, the country is fascinating. And I just want readers you know, whether their readers in the U.S. or my readers in Haiti to really understand that this country isn't about the prices of the moment. But there's so many other rich stories to be told — interesting stories to be told.

00:03:38 King: So let's go to the beginning. You were 14 when you landed a job at your Miami newspaper, as an intern, but 14! You've been driven your whole life to tell stories.

00:03:51 Charles: I know that's so interesting, because journalism was not my first choice that you know, I am partly Haitian and like a lot of Haitian kids, your parents tell you you're going to go off to college, you're going to become a doctor or an engineer, but definitely somewhere in the sciences. But yes, I was 14, I was in a gifted program at Booker T.  Washington, which is an inner-city school, in Miami, junior high. And my teacher invited the executive editor of the Miami Herald and his wife to come talk to us. And so I started asking questions, he assumed that I was interested in journalism. I'm just nosy I was asking these different questions. And then he mentioned that there was a internship program that the Miami Herald had but you had to be 16. And I remember thinking, yes, good. I'm only 14 so I don't qualify. But John Bratcher who went on to be the editor at the Wall Street Journal, He actually called back that day, told my boss —my teacher — that they would have interviews, they were actually hiring a new round of interns. And she drove me down for my first ever job interview, and apparently, I made an impression because the next thing I know, they were offering me an internship at the Miami Herald while I was 14 years old.

00:05:07 King: And so that you really did find your passion, then? Was it been a love affair at different moments? Would you say? Did you know then? You were made for this world?

00:05:18 Charles: No, I knew then when I was in Carolina. But I have to tell you, I've always been interested in writing. I've always been interested in being a storyteller. I enjoy telling stories. — but honestly, it really wasn't until I was at Chapel Hill — and going through a class having a tough time and Chuck stone, the late Chuck Stone, I asked him to look at some of my  writings, my class assignments. And I valued his opinion, you know, I hadn't even taken a class with Chuck. But he was so revered. And I really wanted to hear what he had to say. And I remember it just as this it happened yesterday, he was in Lenoir Hall. He had a tray in his hand that was coming in and I said “Professor Stone, did you get a chance to look at the papers I gave you?” And he had them in the other hand, and he says, “Jacquie, I have them— I looked through them, Jacquie, you can write.”

00:06:18 King: *laughs*

00:06:19 Charles: It's amazing what three words, you know, can do for you. The impact that they could have, but “you can write.” I mean, hearing that from Professor Stone. It energized me. It gave me a certain kind of confidence. That really I was just ready to like, take this on. And I think you know what, forget about trying to be pre-med in journalism. I'm here, I'm at Chapel Hill. I enjoy telling stories. I've got an internship waiting for me this summer, a job when I graduate — It's time to buckle down and get serious about it — And that's really for me was the turning point, that moment when I really decided to just really embrace journalism 100 percent.  

00:07:01 King: And there was another professor, I've heard you talk about Harry Amana, who also pushed you to then be an intrepid reporter.

00:07:11 Charles: Exactly. Professor Amana. You know, he also challenged us and one of the stories I remember from him was coming back from one of my summer internships and him asking how did it go. And I was explaining to him an assignment that I had been given, which was to go knock on the door of a family that just suffered a huge tragedy, the son had just shot the father on the sidewalk outside of the house. And the father was a very well-known or respected pastor in this black community down in South Miami Dade County. And I was explaining to him how I just couldn't do it. I felt like I was infringing on people's privacy. And he challenged me, he says, “what do you mean, you couldn't do it?” You were a reporter, this is the assignment, you needed to go knock on that door, you don't know what would have met you on the other end, maybe they would not have answered, maybe they would have answered invited to in. Maybe they wanted to tell their story. Maybe they would have shut the door in your face. But you never know until you did it. So after that conversation, I have to tell you I’ve never left any door unknocked —no matter how difficult I think the assignment may be. Whatever I may personally think about having to go to a funeral or knock on someone's door. I do it because I have been amazed — time and time and again by people in moments of hardship and tragedy. It is amazing how sometimes people want they want to tell their story. They want somebody to hear their side of things. And so for that I've always been grateful to Professor Amana. And I also told this story during, you know, my graduation speech, my commencement speech, which was his, you know, never let them see you cry. You know, this is just about, you know, having suffered my first shock in journalism, I mean, in terms of the changes and believing that I was going to be promoted, and it didn't happen. And I reached out to him, and in, you know, and never let them see you cry, just about always having confidence in yourself and your ability and understanding the things that happen to you in this business — it's not always about you — whether they're good or bad. It's not always about you, people, you know, it's like chess pieces on a board that has to get moved and [FT?] full time equivalents and employees, you know, their needs, that are needed elsewhere as and other places, but you always have to remain confident in your ability. And then your love of this profession — and you just have to soldier on.

00:09:44 King: I want to ask you, you, of course for our graduation speaker, this 2019. And it was so well received. And I heard students say, “how does she deal with the physical danger?” So you've talked about pushing yourself because Harry Amana was there telling you to knock on the doors, but you've been in situations that can be scary. You've been there when things are violent — when it's just chaos after the earthquake, such — how did you prepare yourself to take on situations which you can't control, and which can be physically demanding?

00:10:13 Charles: I think first and foremost, you have to listen to yourself, you have to trust yourself, right? You have to listen to your instincts. And I am forever grateful for God for always guiding me — whenever I take on one of these trips — because from the moment you get on the plane till you arrive back, you don't know, you know what can happen. I have to tell you in a place like Haiti, for instance, I have a very good driver and I listened to him I don't, I don't argue I don't take unnecessary risks — I used to but I no longer do that — because a dead journalist is not a good journalist, you can't deliver the story. So you really have to ask yourself, you know, is this worth it? What may be lurking around the, you know, around the corner. Recently, I was in Jamaica, and I was in Jamaica on my own, I do not have my trusted Haitian driver with me. And Jamaica is a country that's also you know, somewhat volatile in some areas, you know, that it has an issue with violence. And so you have to just be smart. You know, you can't go you know, sort of flashing or thinking because you're a journalist, you're some superwoman of some superman. Sometimes you have to just try to be discreet. You know, take not trying to take shortcuts. I see that sometimes with you know, young journalists, they try to, you know, take a shortcut — and say, “I'll do this, I'll take this goal,” tab, here and there. No, and you always have to let people know you know, where you are, where you're going to go, who you're going to meet with, and again, listening to your gut, if your gut tells you that — that's not a good idea, you shouldn't do it, you shouldn't do it.

00:11:56 King: One of the things that's intriguing to me is that you've had your whole career since that internship when you were 14 at the Miami Herald. So you've had some stability, one institution, but the business has completely changed and your work has changed. You are a multimedia journalist now.

00:12:13 Charles: Indeed, I am. I mean, the work definitely has changed. I mean when I was at Carolina, I was a print journalist. That was my nature, I really wasn't interested in photography or radio. But today, for instance, I just did a radio interview. I've done video stories. I was in Jamaica two weeks ago, and I took photos — I film video because I said this is a story might be great. But to my son asked me for a photo, and they're going to ask me for a video to do it. I mean, that's the reality of the business. But I have to tell you, I do enjoy making videos, but I enjoy challenging myself to tell the story in a different format. Because the story sometimes is so — it's either so fascinating, or so long, if you can kill it all in front. So you have to find other avenues to do it. And I think that that would be my message to young people today is that you have to be open, you know, you can’t — I have a saying well like to say to folks like that to get out of your own way. You know, you just can't be so rigid. This is a business that is evolving. And one of the editors here said recently “you have to be prepared to fail and fail fast.” You know, that didn't work. Now, what's the next thing? So? Yes, it is. It's a little scary at times, it's a little uncertain. But the reality is, is that people need journalists they need what we do. They need our training, our skill sets, they need that our ability to observe — to basically, you know, the BS meter to figure out what people are not telling you the truth. All of those things are needed because people need information in order to make decisions about their lives.

00:14:02 King: You mentioned Booker T. Washington Middle School, that was a pretty important place for you. But I want to take the quote that I read that you said once that a teacher told you really “don't ever let your zip code define you.” What's that mean? How should we read that?

00:14:20 Charles: I am a product of Miami-Dade County, inner city schools. You know, I'm an immigrant, but I also attended inner city schools in Miami-Dade County. And my teachers have always told us don't allow your zip code the fact that you may live or grow up in a predominantly poor community or you come to you attend a school that doesn't have a lot of resources. You know, truly the sky is the limit. If you want to go to University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, you can go to the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill — even if you've never seen Chapel Hill in your life. And you were from a neighborhood called Overtown. It's a pretty prominently black, you know, community in Miami-Dade County. This is what I tell students is that, you know, we don't as children, we don't choose where we live, right. We don't choose the the circumstances that bring our parents to a new country, or take them to a certain neighborhood and keep them there for whatever reason. But once you graduate from high school, the world really is an oyster, it is yours — it is to do what you want to do to go where you want to go. And you have to believe beyond that difficult.

00:15:38 King: And what did lure you to UNC? What became the beacon for you here?

00:15:44 Charles: You know, even though I told you that I fully embraced journalism 100% my you know, during my tenure at Carolina, the reality is, is that it was there was in my blood. So I'm interning at the you know — at the Miami Herald everybody's giving me pressure to apply for what was then the Knight-Ridder [Minority] scholarship and it was a scholarship in Knight-Ridder. [The predecessor to McClatchy?] will not depress us when they were two which owned the Miami Herald at the time and about 28 other newspapers. They have a scholarship for high school students are interested in journalism — So I won that scholarship. I became the second Knight Ridder scholar for the Miami Herald. So I knew that I wanted to go to school with a very good journalism program. And one of my mentors at the Miami Herald, [Tina Fisher?], also a student of Harry Amana. She basically you know, she was all Carolina, she was like Carolina blue when she was always talking about Chapel Hill. And so I started thinking about it, and I had all these options. But you know, one point I thought about Northwestern, I wanted to go to Georgetown, I was fully enrolled at the UF [University of Florida]. I had a scholarship to University of Miami, but I think you know what, Chapel Hill has a very good reputation for journalism. And I'm going to go to Carolina and plus on top of the fact it was 14 hours from Miami. —*laughs*— Break with my immigrant mother, but then no, but it really was the reputation. And the passion that I saw, like Carolina graduates, me know, when I got to Caroline, I fully understood that. Here's somebody that had been out of college, over five years, 10 years, and they were still passionate about Chapel Hill — and they were still drawn to it. And they were still trying on the lessons learned. And that actually defined to me today. I still draw on those lessons, whether it was you know, from [Professor Baldwin?] or, you know, [area monarch?]. I still look to those years at Carolina when I get myself in a certain line. So hopefully my journalism professor, that was the advice things would have given. I said, you know, a million times, but it truly was the best decision that I've made. And it truly was four best years of my life.

00:18:11 King: Well, we can't say anything more than that. I know. I'm very glad that you picked Chapel Hill. We are thrilled to have you as our grad. It was a wonderful graduation ceremony this year — 2019. And we're expecting more prizes, no pressure, more big stories. Thanks very much for joining us today Jacquie. Great conversation.

00:18:29 Charles: Thank you. Thank you for having me.


June 24, 2019

Corrie MacLaggan '02 is the managing editor of The Texas Tribune, located in Austin, Texas. Click here to read more

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June 4, 2019

Bill Morton '62 is chair emeritus of Jack Morton Worldwide, a leading experiential marketing agency founded by his father, Jack Morton, in 1939. Click here to read more

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April 4, 2019

Ilana Finley '00 is currently the vice president of global communications and social impact at Converse in Boston. She previously served as the senior director of communications for Nike, Inc. Click here to read more

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March 27, 2019

Anu Anand '95 is the host of Marketplace Morning Report from the BBC World Service, a global business program produced jointly by Marketplace and the BBC. Click here to read more

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March 21, 2019

Allen Bosworth '81 is currently the president at EP+Co, an award-winning integrated marketing firm residing in New York and South Carolina. He has worked for the last 30 years front-lining the business side of the firm. Click here to read more

Coming soon


March 5, 2019

Caitlin Owens '14 is a reporter for Axios — an online news publication based in Arlington County, Virginia — where she covers health care and other policy areas on Capitol Hill.  Click here to read more

Coming soon


Feb. 27, 2019

Stefan Prelog '96 (M.A.) is currently a senior vice president at Rubenstein in New York City, where he develops communications and brand building programs for leading alternative investment managers, private equity firms, real estate investment trusts, investment banks and public companies using strategic public relations and digital media solutions.  Click here to read more

Coming soon


Feb. 20, 2019

Leah Ashburn '92 is a second-generation family owner of Highland Brewing Company and serves as its CEO and president.  Click here to read more

Coming soon


Feb. 13, 2019

Ashlan Cousteau '02 is the co-star of the Travel Channel's Caribbean Pirate Treasure, a former Entertainment Tonight correspondent and a fill-in anchor for E! News.  Click here to read more

Coming soon


Feb. 5, 2019

Grace Raynor '15 is a Clemson beat reporter for The Post and Courier in Charleston, South Carolina, and two-time recipient of the South Carolina Sportswriter of the Year.  Click here to read more

Coming soon


Dec. 17, 2018

This special edition Start Here / Never Stop Podcast presents a panel discussion around an important topic within the UNC School of Media and Journalism — how to tell the stories of diverse cultures and communities with sensitivity and respect.  Click here to read more

Coming soon


Nov. 8, 2018

David Tinson '96 is senior vice president of marketing communications at Electronic Arts, a global leader in digital interactive entertainment with critically acclaimed brands such as The Sims, Madden NFL, EA SPORTS FIFA, Battlefield, Need for Speed and Plants vs. Zombies. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Oct. 31, 2018

Delia D'Ambra '14 is a general assignment and investigative reporter for NBC2 WBBH news in Fort Myers, Florida, and the creator of the Counter Clock Podcast. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Oct. 3, 2018

Patrick Winn '03 is the Asia correspondent at Public Radio International, where he focuses on the process of redefining the portrayal of criminals in Southeast Asia. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Sept. 18, 2018

Haleh Moddasser '85 is the lead adviser of Stearns Financial Group in Chapel Hill, providing full service investment management and financial planning services to the Triangle. Click here to read more

Coming soon


July 23, 2018

Chris Brown ’91 and C.L. Brown '94 are alumni brothers who have made their marks on the media landscape in a variety of ways. Chris has written and produced sports programming for national Christian and secular media portals alike. C.L. is a senior writer for The Fieldhouse, the college basketball branch of The Athletic — a subscription-based website featuring in-depth sports coverage. Click here to read more

Coming soon


June 27, 2018

Kit Hoover '92 is a television personality, sportscaster, broadcast journalist and the current co-host of Access Hollywood Live. Click here to read more

Coming soon


May 29, 2018

Andrew Schorr '71 is a medical journalist and the founder of Patient Power, a resource hub that supports and connects cancer patients, caregivers, medical centers and other advocacy organizations. Click here to read more

Coming soon


May 24, 2018

Robyn Tomlin '96 executive editor of The News & Observer and The Herald-Sun, and the first regional editor for the Carolinas for The McClatchy Company. Click here to read more

Coming soon


May 15, 2018

Lindsay Shookus '02 has worked as producer at Saturday Night Live since 2002 and has been nominated for seven Emmy Awards. Click here to read more

Coming soon


April 30, 2018

Reema Khrais '12 is a reporter at the national public radio show, Marketplace. Click here to read more

This is the Start Here / Never Stop Podcast with Dean Susan King of the UNC School of Media and Journalism.

00:13 Dean Susan King: Hello. This is Susan King, the dean of the UNC School of Media and Journalism at Chapel Hill. I am very excited to have with us an alum from the class of 2012: Reema Khrais. How are you and welcome!

00:25 Reema Khrais: I am doing good. Thanks so much for having me.

00:26 King: It's such a pleasure to have you join us because you were in my first graduating class, so you were very important to me. And what a ride you've had from UNC to the prestigious Kroc Fellowship in NPR to the Fletcher Fellowship covering Education Policy at WUNC Radio here to Marketplace in six short years. Wow.

0:00:49.7 Khrais: Yeah, it's been great. It's been wonderful. I couldn't have imagined and I can't believe it's been six years since I've graduated. But thinking back on it, I didn't imagined being here at this point. But, I mean, it made sense. I think one thing led to the other. Even when I was at UNC — it's funny that you mentioned that we were there at the same time — because I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do exactly, and I felt so grateful [for] Professor Adam Hochberg who was there, I mean, he's still there.

0:01:18.4 King: Absolutely.

0:01:20.6 Khrais: Yeah. I honestly credit so much of my career to him just because he was the former correspondent, and we were these timid 19/20 year-old, but he didn't care. He treated us as if we were professionals working at NPR, and that went down to the way he edited, and the way he interacted with us. He had really strict standards starting from there. When I eventually moved on to NPR right after I graduated, I already had a lot of skills on how to write a radio script. I knew how to voice the radio script in a very professional way and — which comparing to the other interns and fellows there — they did not have that necessary kind of training. So, I remember feeling very lucky for that. And at Carolina, I did spend most of my time in general at the journalism school and at Carolina Connection class, hosting and putting together radio script and taking it incredibly seriously. I remember I'd be there like every Friday night before the show airs on Saturday with all my friends and classmates who I'm still in contact with today, and we would go on air the next day. And it just felt like everything in that moment — it really set me up from where I am today.

0:02:40.4 King: Well, I remember you as really a young woman with ambition because part of your Carolina Connection class was to go to Egypt — where you had some roots — and cover the Arab Spring.

0:02:50.4 Khrais: Yeah, yeah. That was a great opportunity because, at that point, I was in training at The Story with Dick Gordon, which unfortunately is not on the air anymore. It was a national radio program based out of Chapel Hill. I was interning there, and I was also interning at CNN the other half of the summer. But then I really wanted to go to Egypt. And I didn't have the funds to go there, and I remember The Story with Dick Gordon didn't have the money either. And so, I actually got a grant through the UNC journalism school. And that was the reason I was able to even go to Egypt and I was there for a month and a half or so and went on the ground and talked to taxi cab drivers and talked to protestors in Tahrir square. That was my first international reporting trip, and I remember feeling really lucky I was able to do that and that The Story and the journalism school gave me that opportunity.

0:03:54.6 King: And I'm so glad we had the funding because it's part of what we believe in; it's really immersing our students in the real kind of experiences of work that they're going to have. Not just theoretical idea that did make a difference turn in to be on the ground to really covering a story.

0:04:11.1 Khrais: Oh yeah, for sure, yeah. And then following that, I guess after I graduated, as you mentioned, I went on into the NPR Kroc fellowship which, funny, I remember that summer, I applied to so many internships and so many opportunities, and I think the fellowship was the one thing I wanted and the one thing I didn't think I was going to get, and then I end up getting it, which is funny how that works out. But then I was in D.C. for another year or so and that was when I met another fellow MJ-school grad and Kroc Fellow, Parth Shah '15. For my fellowship, I had to rotate around NPR for a year. You do like three months of national reporting right after I graduated, I was maybe 21 or even 20 at that point, and my first assignment was a national piece for NPR which felt so intimidating at that time. But again, like I said, I felt like I had the tools and the fundamentals to be able to do that.

0:05:14.2 King: And you've already said that, that was a difference from some of the other Kroc fellows because you got such a good experience learning under Prof. Adam Hochberg. But what was that you would say helped us prepare you. Was the fact that the faculty took you seriously? Was there a fact that there was these immersive experiences? Was the fact that you had the close connection of the people on this radio program that was a weekly experience?

0:05:37.7 Reema Khrais: I mean, yeah, it was all of it. I literally can't emphasize enough how crucial Adam was or is really to my career trajectory. And I mean, I love Adam, but you know, he was also harsh. He told it how it was. If it's something that needed work, he would tell us it needed work; when something was great, he would give us affirmation. He really took his job seriously. For Adam, it was never really the idea that something is good enough — it could always be better, or you could always edit that and make that audio equality just a little bit stronger or make the writing a little bit sharper. He would sit down with you and walk you through it. And so, like I said, even though at the fellowship I remember there were other Kroc fellows who were like, "Oh, you write in this kind of way? I didn't realized that you should do it that kind of way." Essentially, in Adam, it was like we had an NPR editor working over us. And I remember being in the journalism school and I was such close friend with a couple people who are still in the public radio world right now. And now just having that network or that support network even outside of college years later, I mean, I was just texting one of my good friends who I used to host Carolina Connection with. And I was telling him about my latest stories and projects that I'm working on and went to his wedding a few months ago. I am also talking with another person who is working over at StoryCorps right now, and we talked about the project she's working on. So being able to have that network has helped me in college but also beyond.

0:07:30.7 King: But I want to ask you one thing about your experience here that's not a radio experience. You are Muslim-American, Palestinian-American and you know on campus as we're talking a lot, this year particularly, about race and diversity issues, we were all chagrined and disturbed by the way the school year opened with the events in Charlottesville and of course there's a debate here on campus around Silent Sam. What was it like to be a minority? Did you feel supported yourself? How did you deal with being the ‘other’ on campus?

0:08:04.4 Khrais: Yeah, it's so funny you say that. When I was a first year, I had no clue what I wanted to do. I joined the Muslim Students Association. I joined other sort of minority groups and made a lot of close friends that way and just observed what they are doing in terms of their career path or whatever they wanted to do. And so many of them were wanting to go to the med school or wanting to become lawyers. And so, like them, I was like, “Okay, I'll become a doctor, or I'll become a lawyer.” That is what you do, that is a stable career trajectory. And I remember — just to talk a little bit about how much representation matters. I was part of those groups and I remember there's this one student in particular who I would always see around campus lugging around like all this huge camera equipment. And she's Egyptian-American, she's also Muslim, and I remember being so confused and taken aback by the fact that she had decided to go into the journalism school, because I remember, at that point, the idea of pursuing journalism just seemed so wild to me. And not necessarily because I was taught to believe that, but it was more of just I haven't seen enough people who were doing that to make it seem like a feasible career path. And it's funny, I remember going up to her one day, and she was a junior, and I was a first- year and I was like, "can I just shadow you for a day?" And she said, "Sure, I'm actually at this radio class, I'm going to go talk to this scientist on campus and you can just come in and shadow me". And I did that one day after class, and I remember thinking it to be the coolest thing ever because it melded in so many ways all the things that I like, — public speaking and writing — and there was an element of performance to it and it's very artistic. And obviously the journalism aspect to it. And still to this day, she is a close friend of mine, and I still tell her today that I definitely thought to pursue journalism because of her. And I know I'm not completely answering your questions about what it was like to be a minority on campus, but I think it was part of the experience. You become part of this group and you know in many ways I had a good support system, I had people like her to be able to show me what is possible. And I even remember when I signed up for the journalism school, I think at that point you had to choose which path you wanted to go down. I admired her so much in what she was doing, and I was like, "hey, what is the path that you chose again, you did broadcast, right?" and she was like, "Yeah, yeah, TV and radio?" And I was like, "OK, sure." Then I signed up for that blindly. [laughter]

0:11:16.4 King: But how fantastic that it was a positive experience you know. And it makes that point that representation does make a difference so that people who hear you and know you too are not "Susan King", you know you've got a name that has some resonance that is compelling for millions who listen to Marketplace.

0:11:37.8 Khrais: Aww. Yeah. I do think, yeah, representation matters a lot. And that was part of the reason why I wanted to be able to go to journalism, too. I think I do, I mean, I think everyone can provide a different perspective. They tell me their experiences and their background, and I felt like, I could do that. Here at Marketplace, I've been spending a large time reporting on immigration issues and as a daughter of immigrants, I think I'm able to bring some nuance and understanding to the stories. And also, it's a really sensitive topic, right? And people increasingly are uncomfortable talking, especially on the radio, or putting themselves out there, so being able to relate to them in that way and sort of disarm them helps a lot. And I think it's so crucial to be able to have those kind of voices in the newsroom.

0:12:30.4 King: And also, when you were here as the Fletcher Fellow, we had such a tragedy right off campus with three of our students being murdered. And that ended up bringing you into covering that story because it was part of your community and people you know.

0:12:48.4 Khrais: Yeah. That was really tragic.

0:12:50.4 King: And how’d you cover it as someone who was also part of the community grieving?

0:12:55.3 Khrais: Yeah. Yeah, it was really difficult. You know, it’s funny, I even remember the night before or the night off actually we found out about the three Muslim-American students murdered in Chapel Hill. I remember my friend call me that night when she found out because, like you said, they were part of the community. I didn’t know them that well, but I did know of them. And I remember she told me, I remember she was like “Reema, you have to cover this.” And I remember the next day, I had to be at the legislature, and I know it sounds awful that I wondered, “I agree that we need to cover this.” And at that point, details were still coming out, but I remember thinking “will WUNC want to cover this? Will this get attention? Which is sad that I even had that thought. Then when I woke up the next morning and I got a call from NPR national, and they were like, this is a national story. At the point, it was becoming an international story, and I was on that story the next day, and I basically had to turnaround a quick story for NPR across the country. And yeah, I just remember that day specifically was just so difficult talking and processing this with all of my friends. And I remember I had a moment before I went off and did the interviews, and I had to sit in the studio and had to collect myself slowly and just sit there in silence. And then I went out, and I had to report it like you report any other story and sort of remove your emotions in that moment, but also you know, similar to what I was saying earlier because I am part of the community, I think there was an element of trust and trust that I would be able to represent them fairly and to represent the stories fairly and to honor their memory. Yeah, it was a difficult time for everyone.

0:15:00.2 King: Absolutely. But it’s also a moment when you know that you’ve been called to this — this moment and you have to live up to the moment of the profession and the people you love. So, where do you go from here? Do you have a sort of sense of your next ten years?

0:15:18.2 Khrais: Wow, big question. I love radio. I love it a lot, and I think six years ago, I would’ve said that I wanted in this position and now I feel really grateful for that and that I am here reporting for national public radio program. You know, still just getting better and learning, trying to do my job better than the day before. But I love radio, I think I could see myself doing it for another five years. With the boom in podcast — I mean we’re doing a podcast right now — that’s also an interest of mine, being able or work on a podcast one day. So yeah, I see myself staying in radio. If I do leave, I’ll probably go to the more digital side, but I think you know, as you know more than anyone, all this is molding. So who knows which job will be out there. But definitely I’ll be going to stay in journalism. I can’t see myself doing anything else.

0:16:20.4 King: And journalism is worth your best efforts in my estimation. Of course, I am prejudiced, and journalism is an important profession. And I will be remiss for not saying that you won two regional Edward R. Murrow Awards for the coverage of that tragedy here in Chapel Hill. And that’s also an important note that was recognized for the quality of the work under you. And we’re very proud of where you are. I’m very proud that our students can reach this. Look forward to talking to you maybe in six more years to find where you are. But thanks for being with us, Reema.

0:16:53.3 Khrais: Thank you so much for having me, I really appreciate it.


April 6, 2018

Lisa Arney '03 (M.A.) is a senior communications manager at Walt Disney World Parks & Resorts. Click here to read more

Coming soon


March 29, 2018

Kat Downs Mulder '06 is the director of product at The Washington Post and leads a team of product managers and designers who work on The Post's website, native apps, video, email, newsroom tools and subscription products. Click here to read more

Coming soon


March 8, 2018

Brian Strong '00 is the senior vice president of brand communications at FOX Sports, working to elevate the brand storytelling strategy connected to key sports and entertainment moments, digital platforms, major marketing campaigns and special projects. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Feb. 23, 2018

Natasha Duarte '11, '16 (M.A.) is a policy analyst at Center for Democracy & Technology (CDT). CDT is a nonprofit that works to preserve the user-controlled nature of the internet and champion freedom of expression. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Feb. 16, 2018

Christina Vidal '12 is a brand and marketing strategist focused on travel who founded Jetset Christina, a luxury travel website focused on showcasing the best in the world's most swoon-worthy locales. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Feb. 5, 2018

Jason Cooper '01 is a virtual and augmented reality specialist and Chief Digital Officer at Horizon Productions. In addition to recording the podcast, Cooper created a 360-degree video of his conversation with Dean Susan King. Click here to read more and see the 360-degree interview

Coming soon


Dec. 14, 2017

Parth Shah '15 is the second-ever graduate of the MJ-school to receive the prestigious Kroc Fellowship from National Public Radio. Currently, Shah is a producer at NPR working on Hidden Brain, a social science podcast and radio show which links research from psychology and neurobiology with findings from economics, anthropology and sociology, among other fields. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Nov. 30, 2017

Rachel McMahan '17 (M.A.) is the first-ever graduate of the UNC Environment and Science Communication dual-degree program — a path that enabled her to receive a bachelor's degree in environmental studies and a master's degree in mass communication in just five years. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Nov. 22, 2017

Pailin Wedel '04 is a Thai-American video journalist based in Thailand and the founder of TwentyFifty Productions in Bangkok. In 2017, she received a Whicker’s World Funding Award for her documentary, Hope Frozen, a film probing the ethics and morality of cryogenics and the meaning of death. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Nov. 10, 2017

Alexandra Rizk Keane '14 is a film producer, writer and editor and the founder of an independent production company — Rizk Pictures — launched in 2016. Rizk Keane is also producer for the 2017 feature film Literally, Right Before Aaron, a Rizk Pictures Production. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Oct. 23, 2017

Emily Steel '06 is a business reporter at The New York Times, where she has covered the media industry since 2014. While there, her reporting exposed a series of settlements related to sexual harassment allegations against Bill O’Reilly, the former Fox News host. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Oct. 3, 2017

Claudia Howard '03 is currently the global brand manager at The Weather Company, spearheading strategy and execution of marketing efforts to optimize the user experience, and grow and retain the user base for digital and mobile products with partners in various global markets. Click here to read more

Coming soon


March 2, 2017

Jess Clark '15 (M.A.) is WUNC's Fletcher Fellow for Education Policy Reporting. Her reporting focuses on how decisions made at the North Carolina General Assembly affect the state's students, families, teachers and communities. As a graduate student, she was lead writer and managing editor for, a special multimedia report on North Carolina’s hog industry from UNC’s award-winning series, "Powering A Nation." Click here to read more

Coming soon


Jan. 25, 2017

Kathryn Walker '16 was a double major in political science and public relations with a minor in history. On campus, she served as house chair of Kappa Kappa Gamma sorority, chair of the College Republicans and CEO of Carolina Liberty Foundation. The Presidential Scholar program has offered her the opportunity to learn more about higher education through work varying from planning the president’s inauguration to honing writing skills with the communications team. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Dec. 22, 2016

Lisa Stockman '91, '13 (M.A.) is the president of communications for inVentiv Health. She has more than 25 years of communications experience in ethical pharmaceuticals for clients including AbbVie, Amgen, Bayer, Boehringer Ingelheim, Bristol-Myers Squibb, Genentech, GlaxoSmithKline, Johnson & Johnson, Merck, Novartis, Novo Nordisk, Pfizer and Roche as well as consumer goods companies including Coca-Cola. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Nov. 18, 2016

Tarini Parti '12 is a Capitol Hill reporter for BuzzFeed, based in Washington, D.C. She joined BuzzFeed in 2015 after working for Politico, where she covered money and politics, campaigns and agriculture since 2012 following her graduation from the UNC School of Media and Journalism. At Carolina, she served as the managing editor for The Daily Tar Heel and worked internships for the Center for Responsive Politics and The Christian Science Monitor. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Nov. 3, 2016

Leigh Goodwyn '88 is a 1988 graduate of the MJ-school with 20 years of marketing experience with major television networks including Turner Broadcasting and Discovery Networks, where she worked in affiliate marketing, advertising sales/marketing and eventually rose to head of international marketing. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Aug. 12, 2016

Roxane Coche '13 (Ph.D.) — a sports journalist turned university professor — worked as a freelance sports reporter and producer in Paris for three years, collaborating with several TV networks. Passionate about sports and gender equality, her research interests revolve around gender issues in sports media content, especially in online and social media. Most recently, Coche has organized and is leading a study abroad program at the Rio Olympics, featuring 29 MJ-school and 14 University of Memphis students. Click here to read more

Coming soon


July 21, 2016

Aaron Dodson '15 is an assistant editor for The Undefeated, ESPN's premier platform for exploring the intersections of race, sports and culture. In 2015, he graduated from the UNC School of Media and Journalism with a major in reporting and a minor in history. He has previously worked in the sports departments at The Baltimore Sun and The Washington Post. Click here to read more

Coming soon


June 29, 2016

Brad Hamm '96 (Ph.D.) is the dean of the Northwestern University Medill School of Journalism, Media, Integrated Marketing Communications. Previously, he was the dean of the Indiana University Media School. Hamm, who earned his undergraduate degree at Catawba College and his master’s degree in journalism from the University of South Carolina, has also served as associate dean of the School of Communications at Elon University. Click here to read more

Coming soon


May 20, 2016

Nikole Hannah-Jones '03 (M.A.) won a 2016 Peabody Award for her collection of "This American Life" episodes on school segregation called "The Case for School Desegregation Today." The collection includes "Three Miles" and a two-part series called "The Problem We All Live With." Hannah-Jones earned her master's degree from the UNC School of Media and Journalism in 2003, where she was a Park Fellow. Click here to read more

Coming soon


May 4, 2016

Jeff Mittelstadt '12 (M.A.) is the founder and president of WildSides. His goal is to use his background in policy, economics, business, higher education and documentary journalism to cover human-wildlife conflict issues like they've never been covered before. He earned a master's degree at the UNC School of Media and Journalism in 2012, where he was a Roy H. Park Fellow. Click here to read more

Coming soon


April 19, 2016

Brooke Baldwin '01 anchors the 2-4 p.m. edition of CNN Newsroom. Prior to CNN, Baldwin worked at WTTG in Washington, D.C.; WOWK in Charleston/Huntington, W.Va.; and WVIR in Charlottesville, Va. In 2008, Baldwin moved to CNN, based in the network's New York bureau. Click here to read more

Coming soon


April 4, 2016

Rochelle Riley '81 is the Metro Columnist for the Detroit Free Press. On Sunday, April 17, 2016, she was inducted into the Michigan Journalism Hall of Fame, housed at Michigan State University. Click here to read more

Coming soon


March 18, 2016

Justin Lyons '06 graduated from the UNC School of Media and Journalism in 2006 with a public relations specialization. He received the Lois and H.C. Cranford Jr. Award from the school as the outstanding graduating senior in public relations. Click here to read more

Coming soon


Feb. 29, 2016

Carolyn Van Houten '14 was named the 2015 Newspaper Photographer of the Year, 2015 College Photographer of the Year and placed first in the 2014-15 Hearst Journalism Awards Photojournalism Competition. Click here to read more

Coming soon